Date: 2013-09-24 03:23 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] actr.livejournal.com
Я в шоке. Это полный ад и садизм, конечно.
Вот про что надо на всех углах говорить

Date: 2013-09-24 03:50 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] ka-10.livejournal.com
Ничего нового не узнала. Про то, что в тюрьмах творится истинное зло известно уже давно. Жалко Толоконникову, но никак не пойму для себя только: жалко за ее упрямство, или за ее героизм. :(

А к вопросу о рабстве...например, в конституции США вроде как прямо говорится: "Neither slavery nor involuntary servitude, except as a punishment for crime whereof the party shall have been duly convicted, shall exist within the United States, or any place subject to their jurisdiction." То есть, мол, в тюрьме ты вполне себе раб.

Date: 2013-09-24 03:57 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] pro-sha.livejournal.com
The most awful part for me are the comments. Many people are writing that she deserves this.

Date: 2013-09-24 04:22 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] actr.livejournal.com
Угу, ужас

Date: 2013-09-24 04:55 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] marmir.livejournal.com
The really depressing part? It's all too similar to how Americans react to hearing of atrocities at local prisons.
Not to mention Rush Limbaugh, as I recall, suggesting that the Abu Garib abuses were no worse than what one experiences at a fraternity pledge.

Date: 2013-09-24 04:59 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] pro-sha.livejournal.com
Limbaugh is just nuts. I don't take him seriously.

I don't know much about atrocities at local prisons. So I can't judge.

Date: 2013-09-24 05:08 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] marmir.livejournal.com
True, I brought up Limbaugh for laughs only.

On local conditions - Economist has done quite a few lengthy articles on it. Overcrowding, free use of solitary confinement - it's pretty bad.

Date: 2013-09-25 12:26 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] vremyavpered.livejournal.com
i don't know about local prisons, but Immigration prisons are ... well. We don't even know how bad they are because non-inmates aren't allowed in.

heard a few days ago about a four year old (Emily Ruiz) who was detained at the border (so she wasn't in an Imm. prison) kept from her parents for 14 hours, kept in a cold room for those 14 hours and fed only some cookies the entire time. she then was deported. She was a US citizen, too. Now she's back in the states undergoing PTSD treatment.

This was my initial source:
http://www.onthemedia.org/story/my-detainment-story-or-how-i-learned-stop-feeling-safe-my-own-country-and-hate-border-patrol/transcript/
Edited Date: 2013-09-25 12:26 am (UTC)

Date: 2013-09-25 02:55 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] pro-sha.livejournal.com
I am not sure why I am getting all of these comments. Nowhere I argued that US prisons are great.

Date: 2013-09-25 03:00 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] vremyavpered.livejournal.com
what do you mean "all of these comments" -- i only sent one, and i wasn't arguing with you. you said you don't know about the atrocities in local prisons, i thought i'd share the most recent shocking thing I know about prisons in US. please forgive my misunderstanding your comment as an invitation to share information about US prisons.

Date: 2013-09-25 03:09 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] pro-sha.livejournal.com
Two from you and one from Masha
In any case, I do know about deportations. The story of the guy published in the New Yorker and other places is well known by now. Unfortunately deportation officers have wrong incentives. But I don't know if the conditions are such that people have to work 16 hours a day and are not allowed to go to the bathroom.

Date: 2013-09-25 03:18 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] vremyavpered.livejournal.com
Two from me?? Are you going to count this as a third?
no, no 16 hour days and bathroom breaks. because clearly food deprivation and extreme (cold and hot) temperatures are much much less punishing.

Date: 2013-09-25 03:36 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] pro-sha.livejournal.com
Я не понимаю чем я заслужила такой тон

Date: 2013-09-25 03:42 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] vremyavpered.livejournal.com
well, i really don't understand how i deserved the first comment in this thread --
this: http://mamaracha.livejournal.com/132157.html?thread=3653181#t3653181

Date: 2013-09-25 04:09 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] pro-sha.livejournal.com
It was weird I was getting comments on the US jails when I never argued that they are great.

Date: 2013-09-24 05:08 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] skyg74.livejournal.com
Абсолютно ужасно. Я не знаю, как там люди выживают, я б коньки отбросила только от 4х часов сна, не говоря уж про другое. Звучит как концлагеря, и никому нет дела. У большитсва похоже отношение - раз села, то заслужила, и никого не волнует, что у наказание у большинства не соответсвует с виной типа "украла на 3 копейки"

Date: 2013-09-24 07:05 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] seriogina.livejournal.com
Ужасно :(

Date: 2013-09-25 12:17 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] vremyavpered.livejournal.com
полный неописуемый пиздец is about right. also, somehow am not very surprised. North Korea lite.

Date: 2013-09-25 01:22 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] mamaracha.livejournal.com
The sad part that I'm not surprised either....

Date: 2013-09-25 12:49 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] tomka78.livejournal.com
они там просто звереют. иначе никак.

survival.

and yes, this shit happens in most prisons, but T. is sort-of sacrificing herself by bringing attention to it. and that's a start!
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